Guillaume Herisson

D.M.: How does the circular economy help marginalised people get back into the job market? 

G.H.: In my opinion, firms in the solidarity economy have always helped circular models emerge. For me, the oldest example of a circular player from the solidarity economy is Emmaüs, with its models that have been reproduced since it was founded. Any ordinary person can donate their old objects, books and so on. This system has helped democratise and launch many circular movements. Such players operate in that crucial field: collections from donation points throughout France.

D.M.: This was a charitable endeavour at first. But is it now more of a business?

G.H.: The circular economy has helped us, as a player in the solidarity sector, position ourselves in so-called non-advanced activities that some might call non-market activities, though they’re not really non-market affairs. Of course, players like Emmaüs or medical and social players operate in a non-market sector. But players in the solidarity sector like us, helping marginalised people get back into the job market, represent an economic reality.

And we’re in a sector that can’t be mechanised. The flows of this sector don’t allow for capital expenditure and mechanisation. With this particularity, we’ve been able to position ourselves as a key player. Our model in the field of social reintegration is about investing in people – many people, and processes with a lot of repetition. All these factors make us able to get marginalised people into work very quickly.

Right from the first day, a person can work. And very quickly, they can work full time.

D.M.: What you promote is the idea that everyone is employable. For you, each telephone lying around in a drawer can generate business and help marginalised people get back into the job market. Is that what you believe?

G.H.: Absolutely. ARES began in 1991 with partners like France’s national rail service SNCF, which wanted to tackle the issue of vagrancy in its train stations. AREA is a significant player in getting marginalised people back into the job market, with 1,000 people employed. We had to become more professional and make investments. And the circular economy is conducive to the kind of jobs we encourage. It’s a strategic pathway and a pillar of our development. There are two important points:

• The circular economy is a playing field that helps the work of ARES. This model enjoys a good image that boosts the self-confidence of those who work for us. Before the circular economy, this work was associated with waste-sorting and was considered dirty. But now, we send out the message that we enhance careers and develop skills in people, while caring for the planet. So it puts those who work for us in a good light.
• The circular economy is becoming more professional and creating new jobs. We should use this trend to create professionalising pathways for these new jobs in reuse and recycling. These jobs will be a far cry from waste-sorting, which will likely be robotised, and there will be more of them.

D.M.: We’re indeed seeing an improved image of the circular economy. And it’s true it’s getting more professional. But won’t there be a need for a higher level of skills? Isn’t there a risk that the people you employ will become marginalised once again?

G.H.: In 2003, we created one of our activities in the dismantling of computer stock with the arrival of laptops and so on. At that time, we were recycling cathode-ray tubes. Today, there aren’t cathode-ray tubes anymore, but there are smartphones costing €1,000. So we adjusted to this. Our work is constantly evolving. Our profession is changing. Today, people don’t work with the same objects they did twenty years ago. When you work with a client like Econocom, you work in more stages: it’s about providing a product that will work like it’s new. The stages today include plugging in mobile phones, launching the auditing software, and so on.

I could draw a parallel with the work we do for the second-hand book site RecycLivre. This is a good example of our change of scale and professionalisation. We manage the entire logistics chain for RecycLivre. We started with them in a small workshop in 2008 with 1,500 books and now we deliver around a million books a year from a 6,000m² warehouse. We professionalised the approach, but as part of a partnership. With our impact, we supplement the environmental image of its model.

D.M.: How many people are involved in the steps you mention?

G.H.: We actually use a staff trio that oversees the person’s development. This is our key to success. First, there’s a social and work support manager (they oversee the process from the person’s arrival up to their departure into the job market). Second, there’s a team leader (a key person in the process who’s often better than their equivalent in conventional industry as there’s more emphasis on teaching and training and who enjoys the satisfaction of seeing the best talents leave each day to be replaced by people struggling). And third, there’s a job coach (the one who gets the person ready for job interviews). We have to be organised to manage a constant turnover. What we say to people who join ARES is this: ‘You’re not here to stay. The aim is that you find a long-term job elsewhere.’ 

But the biggest issue for our teams is a lack of self-confidence and self-respect. Beyond our help to get people employed, we have to support them in their search for self-esteem. Otherwise, they end up back with us. It’s about helping them find self-confidence and putting their career in a good light. And it’s about making them feel useful and know they play a role in society.

The health crisis highlighted the digital divide. The Emmaüs Connect scheme showed that an old computer has a lot of value for underprivileged families who just have one smartphone for six people. During lockdown, we worked hard to provide children with computers so they could study. When we fight persistently for such a cause, calling upon Econocom and the IT departments of big firms, it really puts those working for us in a good light.

D.M.: What’s the definition of a responsible firm today?

G.H.: I’ll leave out climate issues from my answer as that’s more or less a prerequisite today. Being responsible means uniting all participants around your purpose and expressing its impact. Your purpose should be embodied in your firm.

Responsibility in big firms should also emerge from within, from employees seeking greater social responsibility. In social affairs, firms can take action in skills development, diversity, inclusion and so on.

Responsibility also means keeping people in their jobs and choosing partners and suppliers with high social added value. We need to incorporate into calls for tender the notion of social added value and educate buyers about the best tenders in social terms in clauses on responsible procurement. We need to put humaneness at the heart of our concerns. We’ve still got a lot to do. This can come through legislation, but it should also come from the private sector. As you mentioned, Mr. Bouchard is quiet on the matter, maybe because at the time it was opportunistic, but today it can boost employees’ sense of self-worth.

D.M.: On an individual level, how can we push boundaries for a more responsible society?

G.H.: You need to be creative. That’s the big particularity of players in the solidarity economy. We operate within tight budgets, so inventing and creating is in our DNA. It’s up to us to break down barriers and work with large groups.

We’ve pursued social joint ventures with the firms SEB and Vinci. For me, this movement fits perfectly with the aspirations of new generations (cf. interview this morning with David who saw a girl who was very interested in CSR). In a joint venture, you forge a tie that’s tighter than the bond with a client or a supplier. And it becomes easier for us as we’re then part of a long-term pact and we can focus on the quality of our support. Digital technology is one of the sectors that lags the furthest behind in responsible procurement. Things are changing, but it’s taking a long time. We need to begin with public procurement tenders. A certain momentum needs to get underway. Players should become more responsible. Legislation should be strengthened.

D.M.: How would you like to conclude our discussion?

G.H.: You need to be creative. The crisis has shown us how pressing the health, social, economic and climate emergencies really are. You have to find the means to reinvent yourself. You have to find the means to include others. Leaders need to place their trust in us and work alongside us. We need to work towards complementarity.